The Sovereign and the Priest by Dawn Felagund

I really enjoyed that. I always imagine much more to Finrod than the saintly martyr.

My eyes popped out when I saw what Urloth had requested Finrod/Celegorm in a story that included D/s, collaring, red silk rope, and pagan elements. I use all those in my story of Finrod/Celegorm, and there is nothing I love more than reading a story about a pairing I love that I didn't write.

I really enjoyed the idea of the Calarnómë, of Celegorm being a priest of Oromë. It made the saccharine normality of Valinor much more interesting. (I don't mean saccharine in your story, but in my imagination). Nargothrond is beautifully described, and Finrod's being able to sense every-one in it, that's really fascinating. And so very sad at the end, since we know what is going to happen.

These two are my favourite pairing save Fëanor and Fingolfin (apart from OC pairings) and I could easily have read a whole novel set around this story.

And you made me really interested in Caranthir again.

I forgot to do something this morning because I was so engrossed, and I think I will be in trouble, but it was worth it! :)

I have been toying with the idea of an "underground" part of Tirion for a while now, a place where the not-quite-sanctioned-by-the-Valar activities go on. Urloth's request gave me a good excuse to break it out (and I think Calarnómë will become a part of the Felakverse proper, I like the idea so much)

I would really like to see you pursue that as it does make Valinor feel more palatable to me, and not as if I am transgressing on rareified (and sanctified) ground!

Caranthir is so intriguingthat I also hope to see more of him!

This was a really absorbing treat!

Wow! This is a huge story, using your impressive world-building skills. The shadow world, the sex trade in Valinor, the neighborhood which holds all that and how did your boys put it? "so much more!"

Celegorm is a heartbreaking character, who needed a better world to live in than the one he found in Valinor. Then he does find more in Middle-earth, with Finrod, too little too late. Finrod is odd enough in his own way, perfectly conformist and predictable on the surface, but like Valinor, a lot going on underneath it all. They are both so attractive and extraordinary in this story, while being broken and heartbreaking also. And Finrod IS a good king for his people. If only we could take the oaths out of the story. There goes the story, I guess.

The "fall of the house of Feanor" side of Celegorm is so sad; the lost boy among the crowd of the lesser or younger sons--one who disappoints himself more frequently and thoroughly than he ever disappoints anyone else and who betrays and regrets with seemingly increasing regularity. (And even then I love him.) I love the Priest of Orome concept  (yes! perfect!) and picture-perfect Finrod with his King complex can work for me as well (the son of the third son, never meant to be king, but, of course, he was). I loved the non-Noldorin variant of the theology of their world—I’ll buy it! I also adore the description of the House of Feanor's rebellious side as being actually rather conventional.

I could go on and on; I wonder what Fëanor might have thought if Celegorm had the courage to tell him some of the things that he had learned. I cannot help but think that on some level, it would have raised Celegorm in his estimation. And we always knew there was something different and special about Celegorm, cast as he is so far out of the Noldorin mold. It is brilliant that you took that element and used to support your response to this prompt.

The idea that they agree that Fëanor would have taken the smutty book and turned it into bathroom reading stash! I cracked up and totally believed it.

I 'm blathering now and will need to come back to this later. It is too much to get down off the top of my head and need to step back.

Bottom line: it's a keeper and one that I am sure I will read many times.

I forgot to say that the sex scenes are terrific and the ritual--reminds of the very best of Marion Zimmer Bradley's ritual of the masked king stag in the Mists of Avalon. (random note: I have a deer hunt that borders on this mythology in my story, that chapter is still in raw draft form, I took some ideas from Ellen Kushner and the whole Wild Hunt idea and ran with it there). Themes repeated for centuries upon centuries can always beara few more recycles!

Author's Response:

Okay, I was very relieved to get a positive review from you on this one! :D This was way out of my usual safe-zone and I was more unsure about it as a result. I was curious of those who have read my more typical Felakverse stories would still think that this one worked. I like[d] it but have that protective bias that I think comes from writing a novella and living intensely with this idea in a relatively short period of time! :D I would still like to work on it more, I think--says she who famously doesn't do major revisions!--but I do like it as it stands.

"so much more" ... writing those "fountain scenes" with Celegorm & Friends were some of the most fun scenes to write in the story. This was my first time writing the sons of Finarfin (aside from Finrod) in any serious sense, and they proved quite fun to work with. That they were BFFs with Celegorm and Curufin has always redeemed them in my mind. (Horribly Feanatic, I know!)

"If only we could take the oaths out of the story. There goes the story, I guess."

Ha! Indeed ...

"I love the Priest of Orome concept  (yes! perfect!) and picture-perfect Finrod with his King complex can work for me as well (the son of the third son, never meant to be king, but, of course, he was). I loved the non-Noldorin variant of the theology of their world—I’ll buy it! I also adore the description of the House of Feanor's rebellious side as being actually rather conventional."

I am glad to hear this. How to work in pagan elements into a story about two nobles from cultures that went for the whole moralistic, patriarchal sky-god schtick was definitely challenging! But then Celegorm stands out from his family for a reason, and Finrod strikes me as so open-armed tolerant of others (and more than a little sexually repressed, in this story) that, if it could work with any of the Eldar, it was these two! I dabbled with the idea in that story "Reembodied" about the awakening at Cuivienen; I refuse to believe that the Quendi didn't think about cosmogonical questions until Orome arrived and it all got explained to them by the Valar. Nor am I willing to believe that all of the Quendi bought the Valarin version ... even all of the Eldar. And certainly history shows that paganism and Christianity could coexist and blend, so I like to imagine that the same could happen between the early beliefs of the Quendi and the sanctioned beliefs as explained by the Valar.

Who would think that, of the lot of them, the house of Feanor would be the most staunchly monotheistic? Heh.

"I wonder what Fëanor might have thought if Celegorm had the courage to tell him some of the things that he had learned."

GMTA! I have been thinking about my last two stories to meet my Season of Writing Dangerously goal, and my thought was to do something with the Caranthir story that is hinted at in here but not fully expounded, and to do something with Celegorm and Feanor concerning Celegorm's unconventional beliefs. You pretty much sealed the deal for the last one (and the usual love for Caranthir had already sealed the deal for the first ...)

"I forgot to say that the sex scenes are terrific and the ritual--reminds of the very best of Marion Zimmer Bradley's ritual of the masked king stag in the Mists of Avalon. (random note: I have a deer hunt that borders on this mythology in my story, that chapter is still in raw draft form, I took some ideas from Ellen Kushner and the whole Wild Hunt idea and ran with it there). Themes repeated for centuries upon centuries can always beara few more recycles!"

I just did a reader's theater version of the Epic of Gilgamesh for my students (there's two concepts you probably don't imagine hearing together: reader's theater and Epic of Gilgamesh! :D), and the idea of the year-king appears in that epic. Written about 3,800 years ago. So yeah, it's got some mileage! :D I see it surface constantly in reading about the mythology and history of ancient civilizations, and it's a concept that I find personally fascinating, so it seemed natural to include. MZB's masked stag-king was definitely an influence here too! I love what she does with that in Mists of Avalon. (And Celegorm's favorite festival costume in AMC was as a stag, so it tied back into Felakverse there too.)

You've got me totally intrigued about your own take on it ...

As someone who gets a prompt for a pairing and has to write a novella in order to make the sex scenes make sense (yeah, looking at you BtLOR ...), I'm always relieved when they actually work. Writing sex to write sex is not something I'm good at!

Thank you so much for this very detail and very reassuring comment! :)

This beginning is both dramatic and emotionally intricate--and you make effective use of that detail in HoME that made Aegnor and Angrod close to Celegorm and Curufin.

The scene captures that rather undirected restlessness very well.

Finrod was Nerdanel's student? And the whole of Nargothrond is his work of art? Not an easy thing for an artist, to be gifted also with osanwe--or for a ruler that his realms should be his work of art also!

I waited in the hope of coming up with something eloquent, but in short: I loved the story.  Besides the pairing, which I've come to like more and more as I read Silm fic, you also delved into the relationship between Celegorm and Curufin, which has always intrigued me.  I'm glad to see it explored, and also to see relations between these cousins explored. 

Even if other people have done these things, I just liked your approach to them.  Thank you for writing the story!

Worrying.

You made me feel very sorry for Celegorm, but the undercurrents are really potentially quite ugly. They're basically drifting towards blackmail. And how is it that those who get allied out of feelings of inadequacy start exerting such pressure on each other? Not that it isn't very realistic, of course, it is the way group dynamics often work, apparently even in Valinor!

But I love it that Nolofinwe's big dirty secret is rabbits!

My skin prickled, and I knew that, with those words, some fate that had been following us all on silent feet slipped soundlessly and clicked into place. 

This is a fabulous line. And all the usual complexity and subtlety of your writing is in this gorgeous little jewel.

As boys they are truly a horrid little bunch but you still make me laugh every now and again

Aegnor looked for every excuse he could find to say the word fuck.

because this is pretty much how adolescnet boys are- thinkning non stop about sex and being generally awful.But Curufin is scarily functional about things- and you have really created a sense of his craftiness, in every way. I don't feel he is very good for Celegorm who might well have been a bit different had he clung more to Carnisitr- and I love that they call him the magical instead of being nasty to him.

But this chater unfolds with satisfying details and takes us winding into the underside of Tuna- and that strange scene with Finrod and the young man and the fact that Caranthir knows and tells it- knowing this will satisfy Celegorm but takes no pleasure from it himself- and how does he know? I really like the way you have twined the past and present together in htis.

This has all the potential to be claustrophobic- in Nargothrond, dealing with an initiate of  Orome, and only three characters plus Orodreth makes the odd appreance- surprisngi in his warmth and wisdom! But it is not- it is close, personal and not the usual epic romance and heroism assocaites with these [articalr characters. I like Celegrom's uncertainty, Finrod's careful watching and concern to get it right- his precise stepping around them, and in the background, seemingly unaware, is Curufin clambering around and poking things. I like htat you get that tone perfect for the content- I like reading good writing and htis is.

This is such an intersting study of power in relationships, Curufin's subtle bullying, Caranthir's strange honesty and genrosity of a sort- he seems ot know what Celegorm needs most, to se Finrod, to read the book etc.

And then! Wow. Sudenly the voice of Celegrom gets freed up and liquid, articulate and he has this deep understnading as a priest of Orome! And this is a wonderful vision. I loved this. Still that sense though of inadequacy and he is so undemanding- even though eh is told how beautfiul he is.

phew. Steamy stuff Dawn! How different from Turko of AMC! Finrod is rathr glorious though.

wasn't giving of himself so much as willing the earth to respond to him as he wanted, an act that ultimately pleasured him, when successful. The ritual was a display not of his obsequiousness but of his authority: Even the earth itself rejoiced in him and bowed to his command. Nargothrond itself, I realized as I walked beneath its stone trees, was more than mere artificiality but was itself emblematic of his authority.

This is a wonderful idea- and it does indeed embody Finrod- in every way. And then this:He kissed me again. The kiss between us before, I understood now, was akin to stretching from the side of a ship to trail one's fingers into a warm sea.

Tender as well as passionate. I is delicate wrting because Celegroms narrative voice is tense, stilted almost- and was sly and looking, seeking to pelase Curufin when they were young- compared witht eh confidence of Finrod's voice. Lovely writing.

This is a wonderful chapter - it goes from the deepening affection, love perhaps Celegrom has, and then starts to set out the betrayal by revealing the intense and subtle bullying power of Curufin. This is powerful and insightful-

When had that happened? When had my brother come to look so startlingly like my father that none questioned the easy way he assumed the same degree of authority, authority that should be unthinkable in the voice of a fifth-born son?

Curufin's power is brilliantly written- and it's Finrod's brothers who are part of this. It is very threatening and cold- I have a horrible sense of cold and fatefulness now- great writing.

And that final scene... gave me goosebumps.

Wow- practising druid!! I am genuinely intrigued as I know no one who is a druid- or professes to it. I'd be interested to know what draws you to this as an agnostic- which I am also although probably more and increasingly aetheist, but it is not where I want to be- I want to find something that is beyond, something we don't understand that is not simply explained by scinece- or perhaps I should say yet! There is, I suspect much that is misinformation about druidry - I have always thought Gandalf in that mould actually although less priestly perhaps.

This is a fabulous and for once, cheerful ending even though it is full of portent. I really like the first scene with Orodreth- it reminds me very much of your Caranthir in ANC with the visions and fearful nightmares.

I loved the glimpse of your wonderful Finwe- he is always lovin,g, safe, I imagine him very tall and strong, broad- and like an oak where children can sit safely protected in his arms and his warmth- the yellow that Caranthir saw him as in ANC.  

But this bit is especially wonderful, the idea of the two oaths moving is such an epic, great idea.

The two oaths—they are moving. Like the gears in machines. They are moving and converging, and when they do, I fear so many lives will be crushed between them.
Orodreth lay in sleep free from dreams. I lay beside him, holding him loosely.
The oaths are moving.
I had an awful vision of two enormous animals rising from the earth. For bones they were filled with the machinery of fate, grinding ever steadily onward; some slow gear had clicked into place after centuries, and now their legs straightened and pushed them toward the surface. Mountains crumpled and slid from their backs. They left wounds within the earth that the insatiable sea rushed to fill. When they bellowed, the stars shivered.

In this you have created a sense of something colossal and unstoppable, it;s like releasing the Kraken - once its out, nothing can cage it. 

And then that last paragraph with one of the border guards just detaching itself -face worn and drawn with worry - you are right to leave it there, leave Finrod in his moment of happiness before it all falls apart.

Love the differences between Curufin and Celegorm; from the start they look and sound like two very different persons, Curufin being more calculative and controlled.

"I remember Orodreth used to keep a page in his diary of "Curufin's words" that he and his brothers used when mocking their cousin, who had been simultaneously in their inner-circle and their favorite target for amusement,"

Urgh, teenagers being mean teenagers. I guess Curugin growing in power means he learnt to be meaner than them XD

All of them look so awkward together. Finrod and Curufin with their very formal adresses and Celegorm stuck in the middle. But! I know things are bound to get less awkward at least between the two of them.

"The halls were towering and vast; the stone carved and painted to impersonate the wild green life of Arda so convincingly that I pressed my hand once to a tree trunk, reaching out with my senses and recoiling emotionally and bodily at the cold lifelessness they met. My hand I kept curled upon itself for the rest of the day, feeling as though it might never grow warm again (it did, eventually)"

This part really stresses Celegorm's connection with nature <3

"he ate quickly and rose from the table without much conversation because, "I do not want to hold you back from your conversation with our cousin Finrod.""

Hm Curufin, always subtle when he wants to make his discontent known.

Love the description of the "dark side of the hill", and elves who were not 100% into Valinor. That's a headcanon that followed me for a long time long after I read this fic, and I still use it in my own, but I am quite sure it comes from reading your fic.

Also love how all of them are talking big but know close to nothing actually lol.

"They moved among my work, their faces inscrutable, their emotionless eyes scanning slowly down the lengths of my statues until I felt as exposed as though I myself stood naked before them."

... I guess this is what we all feel when we know someone is currently reading our stuffs, right now, and all the defects of the text just hummps into our face ^^" Poor Finrod sounds like everyone of us upon receiving bad or luckwarm feedback, poor guy.

"Even the rough creations brought to Valinor from the Outer Lands possessed a vision and, therefore, their own savage beauty. They lacked technique, one might say—or, more likely, adequate materials—but were valued more than mine for their vision."

I don't know if you were thinking about the existential crisis that swept over many painters at the end of the XIX/beginning of the XXth century, when they began to have deep admiration for "primitive arts" and started to experience with Cubism and other "naive" trends? Perhaps this part jumped into my face because I have been reading too much Art History recently.

"The Noldor valued stoicism when receiving critiques; if any emotion was permitted, it was anger; many a sharp comment had set off an argument that came to be followed and discussed throughout the city as one might a novel or a play, as something possessing plot twists and conflict."

Oh yes the Noldor love their drama lol.

"I suppose," I said, and realizing that such an answer would not suit—indeed, would provoke—my brother, added quickly, "I mean that I agree wholly."

It's not the first time I get the feeling Celegorm is a bit afraid of Curufin, and that it's easy to pick who has the upperhand in this relationship!

The Parma Ettirniva: What I would give to be able to read what those boys wrote inside lol. And I mean, if they are ready to throw their parents under the bus for secrets, there must be some VERY juicy stuff in there!

"our fathers doled it out thinly in order to produce large broods of mostly nondescript offspring."

Fëanor's kids, nondescript! Really Celegorm?

And Curufin structures his dates. Of course he does.

Celegorm's view of himself and his formative years is so painful to read. I would say that someone must give him a hug, but you and I know that wouldn't actually help. I've been in that place too with all the  siblings advancing in life and the feeling that mine is not, and it's just horrible. I have absolument no problem connecting with Orodreth or Celegorm despising family meals for those reasons.

I happen, however, to be quite in love with Caranthir. He sounds like the kind of guy who just wants to do what he does, be left alone and leave other people alone.

""At the end of it all, although older than me and prone to braggadocio with our cousins about your purported 'conquests,' you are still a perfect innocent, Celegorm."

So I guess that means Caranthir is NOT a perfect innocent!

Curufin is like. A mean teenager, quite the type I do not like much IRL that use less clever and more vulnerable people to be mean. I don't remember if he had some kind of "redemption parts" in this fic or not, but I am starting to wish someone will just give him a taste of his own medicine at some point.

The description of the ceremonies (and religion as a whole) and Celegorm's awakening is something that really hit me the frist time, and hits me again now. It's so well writen, vivid, the world building. Love it <3

Celegorm's relationship with Tauretor seems... off. I really don't feel like Tauretor actually likes him except for his looks and the "son of Fëanor" achievement, and he sounds like he is not really paying attention to what his young lover actually likes, need or wants. Poor Celegorm really missed his chance when he betrayed Caranthir and lost one of the few people who could actually help him get healthy relationships, didn't he?

Religious worldbuidling <3 I love that you managed to give the elves very different beliefs, I feel like it really adds something, and again I find pieces of your work surfacing in mine (as I also have Fëanor as more and more "deviant" religiously speaking as he grows up, some people in Valinor keeping to the "Old Faith", though I usually do that with the people of Formenos). Here I find myself agreeing with Finrod far more than with Curufin, Faith, if sincere, will lead to enlightement, and stomping on other people's believes will help nobody.

"Except for this night, once per year, for I was the king, and so I was the one ceremonially bonded to Arda according to the Avarin tradition."

Big celtic vibes here, with the idea that a king is bonded to his realm, and the health of one is the prosperity of the other.

And that is how the boys discover Caranthir the Magical has a life that is more interesting and daring than all of theirs put together! Of course they would need to ruin that, having nothing to do with their own selves, except Curufin who sounds more and more like a bully, a boy who has everything and still feels the need to spoil other people's fun. He doesn't even have the excuse of being an outsider or of not knowing what his path in life is supposed to be. I do not know if he is just a bad person or if he has hidden trauma, but really, Caranthir deserves better than that.